I have errors on my page, please help

**joaoleitao** · 08-03-2006, 06:08 PM

greetings,
i make web pages for a while already, at a professional level but not with professional studies on web development which makes me encounter a few problems when publishing my pages.

i need help on this matter please since i need to have my websites working. Thank you for your time.

I'm using MfrontPage 5, and all the tables i use, they are completely changed in format when opened with mozilla firefox. nothing happens with internet explorer.

i know this should be a very basic detail, that i should know about. but, there's time to everything. i wish you wil solve my problem.

i have several sites and they just look bad opening with firefox.

you can check the site here and its html code:

site

i have much more sites with the same issue. thank you.

**joaoleitao** · 08-03-2006, 07:19 PM

It seems, i dont have much of a problem. but still i can't solve it.

I can notice that my tables get a huge side border even if i dont have a border on that table. also the tables i have borders, they get a huge border size change.

please help me knowing why my table borders change size in FF. thank you

**boogyman** · 08-03-2006, 07:32 PM

well your borders show like that in Firefox because firefox is standards compliant... Even though IE is used by the majority of the users on the web, it is NOT in any way standards compliant. In the webdevelopment community IE is a POS... you really should look into the use of CSS, which would make your code look alot neater and save you writing out formats for every tag, but if you do not want to do that... just put <whatevertag border="0"> for all of your stuff and you will not have to worry about the borders changing size etc.. how this helped

**joaoleitao** · 08-03-2006, 07:42 PM

hello thank you for your help. i have some tables which i want to use borders. my problem is that even in tables without borders, on FF it comes with borders.

note:
i take this out if the <head>

<meta http-equiv="Content-Style-Type" content="text/ccs">

and the table borders are ok and they look nice, but now, i have another problem. tables are too close.

isnt there a code like this:

<meta http-equiv="Content-Style-Type" content="text/ccs">

that can fix all my problems and make the borders not change in both explorers?

thank you

**joaoleitao** · 08-03-2006, 07:53 PM

how did i almost solved my problem:

i took all the codes on the head of the page:

<meta http-equiv="Content-Style-Type" content="text/ccs">

and inserted:

<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Transitional//FR">

result:

my borders don't change size, BUT i seem to loose many table size... stilll, looks much better than before with the other code. its not still what i want. i would like my page to look like in IE.

what is this code? why does it change my page for better?

<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Transitional//FR">

i also made a change on this code. can i do this?

<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Transitional//EN">

i changed to french since my page is in french.

<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Transitional//FR">

i have no idea what im doing. hehe.

again site

thank you.

**blm126** · 08-03-2006, 08:01 PM

Heres a tutorial on doctypes.
I would say you need this

Code:

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN"
"http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/loose.dtd">

**joaoleitao** · 08-03-2006, 08:22 PM

that didnt help at all. just stayed the same. actually i now have my website with a top and left distancethat i didnt have. still have the same.

i cant believe theres no solution to this problem...

**boogyman** · 08-03-2006, 08:53 PM

yes your page is going to stay the same but wut he posted was the second half of your DOCTYPE tag. and that is some code that tells the browser how to render your page... Since the internet is technically still in its "infancy" compared to other sources of media, the standards that have been made so far have not been taken into effect correctly by all the browsers, eg. Internet Explorer.

your entire top portion of the page should actually encorporate both the DOCTYPE and the meta content tag.

Code:

<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Transitional//EN" "http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/DTD/xhtml1-transitional.dtd">
<html>
<head><title>Your Title</title>
<meta http-equiv="Content-Type" content="text/html; charset=ISO-8859-1" />

I believe would be the right code you are looking for.... however you should take a look at that full tutorial that blm gave you

**mwinter** · 08-03-2006, 09:26 PM

Originally Posted by joaoleitao

I'm using MfrontPage 5

That's generally not a good start. Frontpage is among the worst authoring tools available unless the developer keeps it under tight control. Using it as a WYSIWYG tool is almost certainly going to be a disaster, but then again, that's true for the majority of such applications: Web development is not desktop publishing.

and all the tables i use

All? Unless you have tabular data within your document, there shouldn't be a single table present.

Tables-for-layout was always a hack, one that is no longer necessary. Learn how to use CSS (properly), or at least put it and semantic HTML at the top of your Web to-do list.

they are completely changed in format when opened with mozilla firefox. nothing happens with internet explorer.

As pissa wrote, IE is broken. It is generally advisable to author with Firefox or Opera as your primary browser, and to trigger "Standards" mode by including a complete document type declaration (more on that later). If (more like when) you encounter issues with IE, provide specific fixes for it using conditional comments. That way, as IE slowly moves to become more standards-compliant, it will behave like other, better browsers with relatively little maintenance.

That meta element is pretty pointless (remove it). It's also incorrect: the MIME type for CSS is text/css.

<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Transitional//FR">

That formal public identifier (FPI; the quoted string) is incorrect. The only known HTML and XHTML FPIs are defined by the W3C, and all end "...//EN". The language code identifies the language of the document type definition (DTD), which are always written in English. To specify the language used within the document itself, add a lang attribute to the html element:

HTML Code:

<html lang="fr">

This specifies that all descendants and content are in French. If there are parts in other languages, a lang attribute can also be used on many other elements to denote varying language content.

If you're considering including language-based content negotiation, the server should also send a Content-Language header. If you're not - you only intend to provide a French language version - then don't worry about this.

On a slight tangent, the document type declaration you posted above is for XHTML. Serving XHTML to clients is generally a bad idea for numerous reasons that you find described on the Web. If it's beneficial to work with XML server-side, do so, but transform the result to HTML before serving it to the general population. The Web needs less pseudo-XHTML, not more.

Originally Posted by blm126

Heres a tutorial on doctypes.

It's not exactly accurate from either a modern practical viewpoint, nor a historical technical one (not that I'd expect better from W3Schools). For a better treatise on the use of document type declarations, Henri Sivonen has written a very good description entitled, Activating the Right Layout Mode Using the Doctype Declaration.

I would say you need this

Code:

<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.01 Transitional//EN" "http://www.w3.org/TR/html4/loose.dtd">

It is rare that any new document should be written to the Transitional document type of any flavour of markup. If the OP isn't prepared to rewrite the document(s) in question, then yes, Frontpage output couldn't really be expected to conform to a Strict document type.

Originally Posted by joaoleitao

i cant believe theres no solution to this problem...

There is, but it involves you rewriting the document using modern markup.

Originally Posted by pissa

Since the internet is technically still in its "infancy" compared to other sources of media, the standards that have been made so far have not been taken into effect correctly by all the browsers...

That isn't the reason at all. It is more to do with market competition sparking extraneous feature development in a fight to get ahead, rather than a concerted effort to implement interworking standards.

The first HTML 4.0 specification is ten years old. The HTML 4.01 specification (the current version) is seven years old. The first CSS proposals are around twelve years old as I recall, with CSS1 at ten years old, and CSS2 at eight. There is absolutely no excuse for any major browser vendor to have not fully implemented any of these specifications, yet none have (though some are better than others). Time is not a factor.

your entire top portion of the page should actually encorporate both the DOCTYPE and the meta content tag.

A meta element should not be used to control content types or encoding over the Web. That should be the sole responsibility of the server.

<!DOCTYPE html PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD XHTML 1.0 Transitional//EN" "http://www.w3.org/TR/xhtml1/DTD/xhtml1-transitional.dtd">

Please do not recommend to anyone that they should use XHTML served as HTML, particularly when such persons show a clear lack of understanding of markup. It will not help them at all; quite possibly the opposite, in the long run. Moreover, XHTML Transitional is a joke; a step in completely the wrong direction for modern Web development.

I know you're only trying to help, but this sort of thing is running rampant at the moment and it should not be encouraged.

Mike

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