DD Social Thread (v1)

[keyboard]

Emphasis on "random".
But I do have to agree with you!
I always go online and look up stuff I've forgotten.

[traq]

just FYI, from now on, every time I change my avatar it means I have a new blog post (http://www.dynamicdrive.com/forums/entry.php?267-Every-PHP-Tutorial-Is-Wrong).

enjoy

http://custom-anything.com/images/philosoraptor-oo_LARGE.png

[bernie1227]

wow, that saves me the trouble of looking to the left of the screen on the forum index!

[traq]

:D

just a little jazzed. Never blogged before. Plus, I wanted to share my new PHPhilosoraptor.

I never visit the forum index page anymore - I use the "daily posts" view . Didn't realize there was a "latest blogs" box. sorry!

[bernie1227]

Personally, I preferred the first php philosoraptor :p

[traq]

mm. The first one was good.

I've got a few that are "not quite great":


TUTORIAL: ELIMINATING PROCEDURAL CODE
HOW?
(TRUE==='TRUE') // FALSE
(TRUE == 'FALSE') // TRUE

and one that I like, but it's more of a "socially awkward PHPenguin":


PHP WANTS TO BE TAKEN SERIOUSLY
VERSION 5.3 ADDS "GOTO"

[bernie1227]

php hypertext penguin :p

[traq]

php hypertext penguin :p

Oh $#!+ awesomeness

[bernie1227]

I like the php tutorial by the way

[bernie1227]

I just watched the keynote for the windows surface....... It is quite literally, the coolest tablet I have ever seen ever.

[traq]

Literally!!?. Like, they got it out of a refrigerator?!?

[jscheuer1]

That's cold.

[bernie1227]

Yep, every one is frozen for at least an hour before being sold.

[keyboard]

Well this thread took a strange turn :P
Guess that's what it's here for....

I've never even heard of the keynote... I'll have to go google it.

[bernie1227]

It basically turs the surface into a full pc:
4824

[traq]

oh, I thought the keyboard/cover came with.

[bernie1227]

It does, it kind of clips on.

[traq]

no, I know that; but does it come with the Surface, or is it sold separately? That's what I thought the implication was.

[bernie1227]

It does, it also has a built in stand.

[traq]

Just figured out what the hell "RT" means. Guess I won't be buying that.
And at a projected $1,000, I don't think I'll be buying a Win8 Pro Surface anytime soon, either. :)

I hate that computer "specs" are just feature lists nowadays; you really have to dig to find actual specifications.

[bernie1227]

what does RT mean anyway? What does RTM mean then?
Yes, 'specs' != 'technical specifications'

[traq]

Apparently, the Surface comes with "Windows RT" - it's a metro-app-only version of win8. It won't run normal windows programs (with the exception of the RT versions of Office and IE10).

They had to do it for compatibility with ARM processors.

The full version of Win8 (which will run XP/vista/7 programs) will be available for the surface later on.

[bernie1227]

Well that's just bad. No wonder it's only $600

[bernie1227]

Two and a half stars (http://javascript.about.com/od/reference/gr/dyndrv.htm). Not our best effort I hope.

[james438]

I notice there is no date on that review.

[djr33]

That's about the site, not the forum. And to be fair, it's true to a large extent-- a lot of the scripts are older scripts, intentionally kept around to maintain support (or at least a reference) for anyone using them. That's the case for the no right click scripts, among others. And I can see how someone would get that impression just browsing the site. But at the same time there are a lot of high quality newer scripts as well.

Perhaps it would help the site to present them in such a way that the newer scripts are more obvious than the older ones-- not sure how this could be done (and it would probably require a significant redesign for the main menu) but it's not a bad idea.

Or just adding "deprecated" to some of the older scripts could be similarly effective.

[bernie1227]

To be fair there are a lot of deprecated scripts. At the moment when I get free time I'm having a crack at 'restoring' some of the really hopeless scripts as such. Some of the scripts are actually rather amusing if you go to the really early ones. I specifically like the sound file playing onmouseover one,which only works in ie. This (http://www.dynamicdrive.com/award/)is probably the least legitimate/up to date page of the whole site though. I only brought this whole thing up because I was reading an old thread in the lounge which linked to a rather scathing webdeveloper.com forum post about us.

[keyboard]

Could you post a link to the thread that linked this scathing post?
I'd like to see it...

My personal favourite of the "dodgy" ddscripts is the Watermarking script... it's just css background-image...
I actually kind of want to make a good version of this.... There's something to do in my "spare spare spare" time. (as compared to my spare time)

[Beverleyh]

The dates are on all the scripts though so isnt it at the descretion of the webmaster to decide if they want to use an older one or not?

I dont see a problem personally with the way the scripts are presented/archived - the dates are clear and they make a good reference point (as Dan says).

Maybe a disclaimer could be added to the demo pages to remind people that "this script is more than X months/years old and remains on DD mainly for reference purposes. While this script may continue to function resonably well in modern browsers, please be aware that more modern and efficient scripts are being developed that can be found here [link]/higher up the demo script list pages".

[traq]

Honestly, I think the best approach would be to sort through everything and move the outdated scripts to a "deprecated/support-only" category. It would be a lot of work, though.

[james438]

I'd still like to know how old that review was. The author is apparently no longer part of about.com.

[bernie1227]

I'd say its quite old though, as it was referring to modern browsers as being some early ie and Netscape.

[djr33]

Another option would be to see if they'd do another review. Not sure how to go about that, though.

[bernie1227]

I somehow doubt th result will be that much different. There's a lot of very high quality scripts, but a lot of ones that don't even work in modern browsers.

[djr33]

That's true, but it's focusing on the negative-- if someone took the time to look around for the good parts of the site, they might write a much more positive review. It's all about perspective.

The fact that DD has outdated scripts is really most of what that review focused on-- and it's entirely true. But I don't think the quality of the site is somehow lower just because there are outdated scripts; instead, it's actually probably higher because the old scripts are still there for support (I know this is why ddadmin keeps them around).

But... putting a "deprecated" notice would not hurt anything and would help point the reviewer in the right direction.

[bernie1227]

What about the ones that don't work at all? Do we still need them there?

[djr33]

They're not there to be used-- they're there for people who are already using them, for support. Of course there's also a limit to how much support we'd have available for them.

If you want a project, consider contacting ddadmin to go through the scripts to find the ones that don't work and to suggest replacements-- the text on the pages could be grayed out (but not removed-- if someone has a question about the old script) and then a link could be added to "please use this instead". It sounds reasonable to me, but you'd have to check with him of course.

[traq]

I think we need to clean out the attic, as it were. Get bad stuff out (or into storage, at least :)) and good stuff in.

[keyboard]

I have to agree with traq on this one...
If a script doesn't work (in modern browsers), I don't really think we need to keep it on the main page (maybe an archive instead?).

[bernie1227]

They're not there to be used-- they're there for people who are already using them, for support. Of course there's also a limit to how much support we'd have available for them.

How many people use scripts that don't work?

[djr33]

To everyone, let me add that I'm just explaining ddadmin's policy. I had the same questions a while ago and he said that he specifically keeps the old scripts around for support reasons-- to not abandon those who are using them.
But it may be time to revisit that. I don't disagree, but I see his point as well.

---
Bernie,

How many people use scripts that don't work? There are three groups of relevant users:
1. Users who have a semi-working script on their page who aren't aware that it doesn't work for everyone, or doesn't work well. An example here is a "no right click" script that doesn't actually work (not for many people anyway) but makes them happy.

2. Users who have an old site that just doesn't work any more-- they may want to modernize it, and why not stop by DD to see if there's an update?

3. Uses who now find these scripts and want to use them. A lot of the outdated scripts also represent an older style of scripts, such as "no right click" scripts-- those just aren't a big thing at this point in time, and they also don't really work; but that doesn't mean people don't WANT them. And when they search for them, they end up here. (Admittedly it's slightly confusing if they don't work well, but they work as well as they can, which isn't well.)


In fact, the 3rd group also represents another reason to keep the scripts around-- to attract more users to DD who want those scripts-- if not, they'll go somewhere else.

[bernie1227]

I'm not talking about scripts that don't work 'well', I'm talking about scripts that do not work at all, as in, nothing happens at all fr people who aren't using ie4 and netscape.
I suppose it can be best said in the words of James (Twey) and ricp from webdeveloper.com:


You could not be more right. There is some utterly atrocious JS out there, and a fair percentage of that is people claiming to know what they are doing. The people in charge of things like DynamicDrive should be stabbed in the face, repeatedly. They spread bad code like the plague.


Thing is JS is a scripting language it is just not comparable to PHP/C#/Java and the like and not just because they exist in different environments (that said you can code JS server side). JS is really showing it's age and no amount of polishing with stupid buzzwords (web2.0/ajax/etc) can paper over the cracks.

That said, I love the fact it is unbelievably loosely typed (want a string? add a "". want a number? times it by 1. stunning!).

and then James' reply:


You could not be more right. There is some utterly atrocious JS out there, and a fair percentage of that is people claiming to know what they are doing. The people in charge of things like DynamicDrive should be stabbed in the face, repeatedly. They spread bad code like the plague.

I'm not so sure about the stabbing-in-the-face part, but other than that, you're right. You've quite stirred up the forums over there, so we've decided to have a mad rush to rewrite as many scripts as possible. I'd like to offer you the chance to join in

Thing is JS is a scripting language it is just not comparable to PHP/C#/Java and the like and not just because they exist in different environments (that said you can code JS server side). JS is really showing it's age and no amount of polishing with stupid buzzwords (web2.0/ajax/etc) can paper over the cracks.

Mozilla agrees with you, and thus should be bringing Python as a built-in client-side scripting language into the next version of Firefox. Obviously at first this will only be of use to extension developers, but hopefully it'll catch on with other browsers too.

Originally Posted by boxxertrumps
I agree that allot of people only Think they know what they're doing, but that goes for any sort of profession/hobby.
More so in this profession than others, I'm afraid.

And what makes the code "bad"?
Most of the code on DD is inefficient and/or full of bad coding practices such as browser detection. A few scripts don't work at all in anything but IE.

[djr33]

Well, that's still "not well" in that those might be websites designed for those browsers. The scripts aren't broken; the browsers have just changed.

Obviously we shouldn't recommend using them now, but should all traces of them be removed from the site in case anyone has a question about them? Again, a question for ddadmin.

[bernie1227]

crosspost/edit, read the new post ^

Recently I've been having a crack at 'restoring' some of them (starting a few weeks ago), and some of them frankly, aren't really worth restoring.

[djr33]

I was serious when I suggested that you compile a list of outdated/problematic scripts for ddadmin :)
And of course updating them is a good idea-- you can post those in the bug reports section (I think these are bugs); or just the submit-a-script section if they're only improvements to functional scripts.

[bernie1227]

I was serious when I suggested that you compile a list of outdated/problematic scripts for ddadmin :)

I did that a few weeks ago :p


And of course updating them is a good idea-- you can post those in the bug reports section (I think these are bugs); or just the submit-a-script section if they're only improvements to functional scripts.
ddadmin suggested blogging them, as that might be more accesible than finding a forum post.

[djr33]

Hm, where was that? And sure, blogging it is fine-- it depends on scale. You shouldn't post hundreds of threads, but maybe one thread with everything if you're doing it systematically, or just a few threads if you're only looking at a couple scripts independently.

[bernie1227]

Hm, where was that?

via pm.


And sure, blogging it is fine-- it depends on scale. You shouldn't post hundreds of threads, but maybe one thread with everything if you're doing it systematically, or just a few threads if you're only looking at a couple scripts independently.
Once I've finished restoring all the ones I'm planning on restoring, I'll post them all in the form of jsfiddles or try and put them up for download somewhere on a blog. Basically I'm planning on releasing them all at once (hopefully sometime during summer (Australian summer,otherwise you'll be waiting a while :p)).

[djr33]

Ok, sounds fine to me! :)

[keyboard]

I've been reading through some old threads with Bernie, and these are my personal favourites... Rotf.

http://www.dynamicdrive.com/forums/showthread.php?14619-share-your-craziest-dream
http://www.dynamicdrive.com/forums/showthread.php?14586-nanner-tubes
http://www.dynamicdrive.com/forums/showthread.php?7256-Multi-Laptop
http://www.dynamicdrive.com/forums/showthread.php?21071-Guys-please-help-me-%28
www.dynamicdrive.com/forums/showthread.php?16212-Mac-vs-P

[bernie1227]

My personal favorite, I have to say it's pretty good:
http://www.dynamicdrive.com/forums/showthread.php?21071-Guys-please-help-me-(
probably one of the most vitally important threads:
http://www.dynamicdrive.com/forums/showthread.php?6586-hi-ppl
One of John's attacks of comic wit:
http://www.dynamicdrive.com/forums/showthread.php?39019-Funny-Stuff

[bernie1227]

Traq, new blog and no avatar change? Frankly, I'm disappointed.

[traq]

Traq, new blog and no avatar change? Frankly, I'm disappointed.
sorry, Sorry, SORRY I was on medication last night...

[Beverleyh]

Whisky in hot water? mmmmmedicinal, hic! ;)

Weren't you supposed to have been giving thanks or something yesterday?

[djr33]

The fourth Thursday in November used to be known as Thanksgiving-- let it now be known as eat lots of turkey and buy a big TV day.

("Black Friday", the day after Thanksgiving, has now merged into Thanksgiving evening.)

[Beverleyh]

I absolutely love turkey! Can't wait til my Xmas dins!

I am mildly annoyed that we don't get a similar holiday/excuse to eat in the UK - I had pitiful poached eggs and tomatoes on toast for my dinner. Pah! But, now that you've got me thinking about it, I'm going to treat myself to a nice hot turkey, stuffing and cranberry cob from the sandwich shop up the road. Roll on lunch time tomorrow! I will feed and I will be thankful that convenient savoury goodness is but 50 short yards away!

[traq]

No kidding - I dropped by Best Buy last Sunday and had to walk around the line of tents. People camped out for almost a week with their kids, in the cold - for a TV. Pissed me off.

Beverleyh - no, it was real medicine. I pulled my shoulder somehow.

[djr33]

Yeah, it was a bit crazy. Best Buy? Those prices weren't even very good. Walmart had the best deal, but they sold out quickly-- $688 for a 60" HDTV.

But I ended up with what I wanted (at a different store, hhgregg), a 60" 3D HDTV (Samsung), for around $1200. Not a cheap pricetag, but I've been wanting one for a while and it was the right day to buy one and it was relatively "cheap". Long lines, but I didn't have to get there early and wait outside at least.

I was a bit uncertain about 3D because there's so little available to watch, but it's fun at least, and I was happily surprised that it actually has a "convert to 3D" option for real-time simulation of 3D-- not as good as something actually made for 3D, but it gives it some depth, for any content. Pretty cool.

[bernie1227]

I didn't even know it was thanksgiving.....

[traq]

just FYI, from now on, every time I change my avatar it means I have a new blog post.

Traq, new blog and no avatar change? Frankly, I'm disappointed.

Happy?
and don't call me Frankly

[Beverleyh]

I didn't even know it was thanksgiving.....
I dropped by a few times and wondered why nobody had posted in about 12 hours ;)

The TV situation sounds crazy. And camping to grab a bargain? I thought the Brits had queuing in the bag, but that takes the biscuit.

Hope your shoulder gets better quickly traq. You didn't do it through lugging any heavy Thanks Giving bird out the oven, did you?

[traq]

nah, it's a old problem that gets aggravated every so often. And thanks!

[Beverleyh]

One of John's attacks of comic wit:
http://www.dynamicdrive.com/forums/showthread.php?39019-Funny-Stuff
Ha, ha - I enjoyed those. I sent the link to my dad - he's taking a printout down the pub to amuse the regulars!

[Beverleyh]

nah, it's a old problem that gets aggravated every so often. And thanks!Urk! Those 'war injuries' that keep coming back to haunt you are the worst. My boyf has a dodgy shoulder too - its getting so twitchy that he just has to sleep in the wrong position and it pops out. He loves climbing too, which is a weird one because if he builds it up over time, it actually helps strengthen his shoulder, but then if goes at it a bit to quickly, POP!, and he's stuck on the sofa again for a while.

Oh, to be 12 again, where we could run around all day, hang out of trees, and enjoy a quick round of fisticuffs with the brat down the street, without anything more than a scuffed knee. We must be getting old.

[djr33]

I dropped by a few times and wondered why nobody had posted in about 12 hours Yes, everyone was too full of turkey to type!
(Or waiting in line...)

[bernie1227]

I fell like I must have been missing out on some quality tv prices....

[djr33]

<complaint style="ranting;">

Firefox is now asking me to update to "version 17.0.1". YAY!!!! (Not.)

Why, Mozilla, why??

Here's a nice graphical representation (though a bit tall) of the mistakes Mozilla has made over the past 2 years. Since 2012 is almost over, perhaps it's time to commemorate the death of Firefox as it grows older and older and slowly, but now more rapidly, approaches retirement and soon after is gone from the web forever. (Mozilla is probably unaware of this; they think they're doing just a great job releasing a new version of the browser every few weeks. Right...)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Timeline_of_web_browsers


And Chrome isn't innocent either. But at least, as far as I can tell, it's not actually becoming worse with each update. But who in their right mind would release a new software version every few weeks????

I rarely have anything nice to say about IE or Microsoft, but M$ really has figured this one out-- release a new browser every year or two. And at least, despite many problems earlier, the new releases of IE are significant improvements. With Firefox it's usually "we moved menu X somewhere you can't find it, haha!", and with Chrome, I suppose it must be "now there's even less in the browser!".

</complaint>

[bernie1227]

suppose it must be "now there's even less in the browser!".

I think that's fairly incorrect actually, I have not noticed any less functionality than the day I began using it.

[djr33]

I meant the "Chrome", not the underlying functionality ;)

After all, in a few more releases of FF, I'll probably be using Chrome anyway, so it better be good! Haha.

[bernie1227]

I'm particularly fond of the dev tools and the plugins :)

[traq]

the dev tools are fantastic.

[bernie1227]

I know..... That's why I'm fond of them :P

[djr33]

Interestingly, no one is defending FF.... silly Mozilla.

[bernie1227]

Wait for keyboard, as a very new FF user, he'll most likely defend Firefox rather vehemently :P

[djr33]

What I mean is that I'm usually the biggest advocate of FF over all other browsers. But now I'm really tired of it. About ready to move on.

[bernie1227]

So you're likely to go to chrome then?

[keyboard]

YOU DISLIKE FIREFOX!?!?
HOW DARE THOU INSULT MY HONOUR!!!

Thou cream faced loon. Where got'st that goose look?
Could I come near your beauty with my nails I'd set my ten commandments in your face.

Joking... you don't look at all like a goose and I'd never hurt your face. Please don't report me for flaming :p

And whoever said my book of Shakespearian insults wouldn't be usefull?

But seriously, I do like firefox, and wouldn't use anything else... Actually, if I did have to use anything else, it'd probably be IE9.

[bernie1227]

But seriously, I do like firefox, and wouldn't use anything else... Actually, if I did have to use anything else, it'd probably be IE9.

Ignoring the flaming, I'm not a fan of either of those two browsers, and feel that chrome is going into a much better direction than ff or IE.

[djr33]

Ah, so FF hasn't been abandoned by all. (And I'm still using it by the way, but mostly out of habit rather than true preference.)

Up until 6-12 months ago, I was FF's strongest supporter. (Although I had a couple add-ons enabled to fix the recent "improvements" in UI.) But I've grown increasingly more tired of bothering with it. I believe the proper metaphor is "rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic"... the ship's going down, so I may as well move over to Chrome. At this point I think it's a question of when, not if. Although I'd be happy to stay with FF if it took a significant change in direction to go back to what used to be great about it and didn't keep copying Chrome and releasing a new version every month!!



Bernie, arguably IE is headed in the best "direction" in the sense that it's improving so much with each new release. The change from IE5 through IE10 is profound. It's still far from my preference (regardless, I don't use Windows), but I have to give it at least that much credit.

[bernie1227]

IE10 is built for the masses. That basically says all I could say about it.

I still don't know why keyboard insisted on going to firefox instead of chrome..

[keyboard]

I like it's plugins more.
I like it's ui more.

And you can't turn private browsing on permanetly in Chrome ;)

[djr33]

I like the old FF UI more than any other (including the current FF UI).

I like the plugins available. I'm not sure that all of it will be available in Chrome. But I'll take a look at some point.

[bernie1227]

I like it's plugins more.

I don't really get that one because almost all plugins on firefox have a counterpart on chrome and vice-versa.


I like it's ui more.

Theme control is much more prominent in google chrome, so you can change the browser to how you want it to look rather than what mozilla wants it look, and with the whole Firefox trying to imitate Chrome deal, I wouldn't be so surprised if that started becoming very true ui wise as well. My advice there, get used to looking at chrome's better ui.


And you can't turn private browsing on permanetly in Chrome ;)
1) You can
2) The only people who turn on private browsing (or incognito mode) are those who have something to hide. That's not a good thing.

[keyboard]

I'm pretty sure you can't turn incognito mode on permantatly...
And actually, it'd got nothing to do with hiding something...
It's more to do with stopping websites tracking you...


My advice there, get used to looking at chrome's better ui.
I just said I prefer firefox's. Therefor Chrome's isn't better in my opinion rendering that statement null. I don't want to get used to it anyway.

[bernie1227]

Actually you can. Besides, private browsing won't stop pekoe tracking you, it just clears cookies at the end of browsing and doesn't take history.

My statement is not null, as in my, and in many other people's opinion, the chrome ui is far better. As I said before, you can customise it as much as you want. You can make your own themes.

IMO, and many other people's opinions, traq being one of them, Chrome's devtools are far superior.
IMO, and many other people's opinions, Chrome's ui is superior.
IMO, and many other people's opinions, Chrome is better.

[djr33]

Let's not argue about opinions. You can't really think you're going to convince anyone, right? (And to the extent that it's relevant, I strongly prefer FF3's theme to any others. And about 70,000 users of current versions of FF agree, based on the number of downloads on the add-ons site!)

I have no idea about the devtools. That's fine for web design, but I'm more concerned with my daily life on the net. For example, visiting DD. What's best for that? Unrelated to the devtools.

For the UI, it's personal preference, and that's really the central thing for which one will be my main browser (plus, of course, basic standards and reliability!).

For "better", well, who knows anyway? That's a vague question.

[bernie1227]

number of downloads on the add-ons site!)
I wouldn't bring download numbers into it, chrome web store has racked up a fair number as well.


I have no idea about the devtools. That's fine for web design, but I'm more concerned with my daily life on the net. For example, visiting DD. What's best for that? Unrelated to the devtools.

I find that chrome offers quite a good browsing experience as compared to other browsers.


For "better", well, who knows anyway? That's a vague question.
All we need is for some psychologist to figure out a test for the best browser, then we can drag up the old arguments. As long as there are web browsers, users will try and convince other users that their browser is better. You and keyboard are no different.

[keyboard]

I wouldn't bring download numbers into it, chrome web store has racked up a fair number as well.


You're missing the point of Daniel's statement. He's saying that a lot of people prefer the FF3 UI



All we need is for some psychologist to figure out a test for the best browser, then we can drag up the old arguments. As long as there are web browsers, users will try and convince other users that their browser is better. You and keyboard are no different.

If only :p

You can customise firefox completly as well...

Also, other people's opinions don't matter.
Every single person in the world can think Safari is the best browser, but it still won't make me like it.

[bernie1227]

Also, other people's opinions don't matter.


That has to be the most wildly innacurate statement of the whole thread.

[jscheuer1]

MS updates their browser pretty frequently as well. These are (if you have them turned on) part of the automatic update process of Windows.

I don't think that frequent updating is bad. It's what the updates are. They are after all a part of the browser. Software cannot stand still. A browser needs to continually fix bugs and plug security holes as they appear and are resolved. Adding speed and features is nice as well but not as critical.

[djr33]

I have no problem with frequent minor updates. At the moment we should be maybe at approximately Firefox 5. If all of the last 2 years' updates had been 4.1, 4.1.1, 4.2.7, 4.5, 4.8, and finally 5, I'd be perfectly content with their update strategy. But by calling them full version numbers, I think there is something completely wrong with their strategy.

There are two things wrong with the updates (and you're right about that, John!):
1. The psychology/strategy/whatever of updating to a new number every 6 weeks is misguided. I believe it puts the focus on the updates and the number, while ignoring the product. FF was good before these updates. It's bad now. I'm assuming there's a connection. Part of it is probably that by having a whole new version number they can change things significantly and make old add-ons incompatible (if it was all under "FF4" there would be less of an excuse to change things around completely). It sort of feels like they put FF through a blender every month. There's also, I think, much less focus on actually improving each version with subversions. Instead, it's just time to make FF20 or whatever.
2. As you said, the actual updates are bad. But as someone who was happy with the old FF, I'd like to imagine it would have changed a lot less over the past two years if it were just updating subversions. So it would take them less time to drive it off the metaphorical cliff, so to speak, even if that's what they were trying to do.





Also, other people's opinions don't matter.
That has to be the most wildly innacurate statement of the whole thread. You do realize that people are autonomous individuals and, despite some social conventions and trends, do actually behave individually with their own opinions, right? To say "best" and imagine some psychological test that could find it, taking individuality out of it, is, ironically perhaps the "most wildly inaccurate statement of the whole thread" ;)

I have no problem with you liking Chrome (or Opera, or Safari or whatever). But the fact that you like those doesn't mean that I do.

The entire concept of "individual differences" gets a huge amount of attention in psychological research. (And that's more or less a technical term, not just my description.)

[keyboard]

You do realize that people are autonomous individuals and, despite some social conventions and trends, do actually behave individually with their own opinions, right? To say "best" and imagine some psychological test that could find it, taking individuality out of it, is, ironically perhaps the "most wildly inaccurate statement of the whole thread" ;)

I have no problem with you liking Chrome (or Opera, or Safari or whatever). But the fact that you like those doesn't mean that I do.

The entire concept of "individual differences" gets a huge amount of attention in psychological research. (And that's more or less a technical term, not just my description.)

Perhaps my point was poorly worded, but Daniel explained it better than I can.
(People's opinions on webbrowsers will not change my opinion)

[bernie1227]

You do realize that people are autonomous individuals and, despite some social conventions and trends, do actually behave individually with their own opinions, right? To say "best" and imagine some psychological test that could find it, taking individuality out of it, is, ironically perhaps the "most wildly inaccurate statement of the whole thread" ;)

A couple of issues with this here statement; my part about the test for the 'best' was a purely hypothetical situation in which you could take something completely subjective and view it objectively. Of course that is not possible, and as such, I don't see how I have said the "most wiled let inaccurate statement of the whole thread", however, if keyboard's statement was true, (which it obviously is not), then people would really just go around doing whatever the heck they felt like, and both social convention and even things such as empathy would be rendered null and void. If there was such a thing as a world where other people's opinions didn't matter, I would most definitely not want to live in it.


I have no problem with you liking Chrome (or Opera, or Safari or whatever). But the fact that you like those doesn't mean that I do.
And vice versa.

Perhaps my point was poorly worded, but Daniel explained it better than I can.
(People's opinions on webbrowsers will not change my opinion)

If that was your point, then it was poorly worded indeed. So you're basically saying, that if every other ff user were to switch to chrome, and all sort of support was dropped, you would stay with Firefox (assuming it still had the same traits that you are so in love with now)?

[keyboard]

If that was your point, then it was poorly worded indeed. So you're basically saying, that if every other ff user were to switch to chrome, and all sort of support was dropped, you would stay with Firefox (assuming it still had the same traits that you are so in love with now)?

I don't love firefox, I simply like it more than the others.
Yes, if I was the only person in the world that used firefox, and it stayed the same that it is now, I'd continue to use it.

[bernie1227]

Seem thing must also be said however, for trying other browsers, for example, the only two browsers you've ever used regularly are ff and ie, would you still feel the same if you'd spent the same time on chrome and opera as well?

[keyboard]

Admittadly, no, I probably wouldn't.
I've used chrome regulary for about a week before I decided I didn't like it and went back to firefox...
I've never used Opera for anything other than webdevelopment...

[bernie1227]

Fair enough :P

[jscheuer1]

It took me a long time to warm up to Chrome. I originally had it for testing only. But as FX became more and more unstable and sluggish, I decided to make the switch to Chrome. After all, having used it for so long, I was becoming familiar with it. I had it for at least 6 months, maybe longer, before I switched over to it on a more or less permanent basis.

I still use Opera for browsing, but my primary - the browser launched when my editor or anything tied to the OS calls for a browser was always FX. Now it's Chrome. What I like about it is its stability, low memory profile and wealth of developer tools integrated into it, not as they are with FX where they're cumbersome add ons.

[bernie1227]

Christmas fact 1: partridges are land birds; you need to scare them if you want to get them into a pear tree.

[djr33]

Ah, the wonderful traditions given to us by our ancestors.

Also that one about chopping a tree down and putting it inside your house!

[keyboard]

On an un-related note, I just cleaned my screen, and have had to lower my screen brightness settings several bars as a result of this... Cleanliness for the win!

[jscheuer1]

No trees were harmed . . .
4862

[Beverleyh]

Ah, the wonderful traditions given to us by our ancestors.

Also that one about chopping a tree down and putting it inside your house!

Yey to Germany and good old Prince Albert!

[bernie1227]

'twas the night before Christmas,
and all through the house,
not a creature was moving,
not even a mouse.


Anyway,
♫I'm dreaming of a wet Christmas♫
Or maybe it's "white"?
Anyway, my ol' friend the cold front is coming in to stay for Christmas, so the former is more appropriate.

Almost forgot,

Christmas fact 2: ten lords, a'leaping or not, will set you back roughly £4000, or a few good cases of port.

[Beverleyh]

Christmas fact 2: ten lords, a'leaping or not, will set you back roughly £4000, or a few good cases of port.or let 9 of them make merry with the dancing ladies and then you only have to buy one bottle of port for the remainder ;)

Pretty soggy here too - totally persisting it down in fact!

[keyboard]

Merry Christmas everyone!
I realise that it probably won't be Christmas for you yet, but oh well!!!
Have a lovely day :)

[bernie1227]

I concur,
Merry Christmas!

Although most of you aren't in Christmas yet. I think James might be on the 25th out at Davenport, but Derbyshire, Pennsylvania and Illinois are all on the 24th, although I may be wrong about that.

[keyboard]

Also England and France still aren't... It's last night for them :(

[Beverleyh]

Just turning 11pm on the 24th in the UK - I have allowed my sister to open ONE present early and now she is snoozing on the settee after drinking a few more glasses of wine than me ;)

I am currently watching the Pierce Brosnan remake of The Thomas Crown Affair while perusing DD on iphone.

Merry Christmas everybody!

[jscheuer1]

I think I prefer the original. It is a good remake though, a bit of a re-imagining as well.

55 mins to go here till Santa time. We got a little snow! My favorite kind, just enough to make things look festive, not enough to shovel.

Merry Happy Everyone!

[traq]

Merry Christmas, all!

[djr33]

As I've now returned to California for just over a week, it's not quite Christmas here yet. In about 40 minutes...

Have fun, everyone!

[traq]

ha ha, I'm in CA too, I was just putting it out there before I knocked off for the night :)

[ajfmrf]

I hope everyone had a great Christmas,if you celebrate it

[traq]

We're mostly not designers, here, but freelancing is much the same (http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=-lY9Nl8QrOA), yes?

[Gustii]

Yes it is

[djr33]

I thought I'd reopen the social thread to see if the conversation should continue. We locked it earlier because it was a spam magnet, but maybe that has died down. We can lock it again if that happens or if there's not too much to converse about.


Anyway:

Happy New Year's to everyone!


Personally I am planning to be more organized. For one thing, just today I got my (personaly) website back up and fully functional (not a lot of errors and other oddities). And I only broke all of the websites on my server for about 5 seconds. I hope no one was looking. I'm also planning to get back to some older projects. I hope I have a little more time in the coming year. There's a lot to do!

[Beverleyh]

And I only broke all of the websites on my server for about 5 seconds. I hope no one was looking. I was, and I laughed and I laughed... Hee, hee. No, not really - I've been there too after a rather unfortunate foo with a recursive delete script (oops!).

My New Years project will be to remake the FOF website in full responsive, mobile-first glory. And my New Years resolution is to eat more fruit, get up and talk to colleagues in the next room instead of emailing, and be nicer to spiders.

Happy new year everyone!

7 mins til midnight here...

[jscheuer1]

Nicer to spiders?

Happy New Year!!!!!

[djr33]

I was, and I laughed and I laughed... Hee, hee. No, not really - I've been there too after a rather unfortunate foo with a recursive delete script (oops!).Mine was only the virtual version of that-- I set a 301 redirect for all pages on all websites on my server. I was trying to just apply it to one (restricted access) domain, but set the "rewrite condition" incorrectly. Shows what I know about .htacess..... anyway, all fixed.


So then, I suppose this will be a nicer year for the spiders!

[jscheuer1]

Less no follows? Or less squishing?

[james438]

Happy New Years everyone! No resolutions for me this year, but I am eager to see what new adventures this year brings.

[Beverleyh]

Less no follows? Or less squishing?

Ha, ha - I didn't think of that, but I suppose both kinds of spiders need some TLC. I was initially thinking that I need to be a bit more careful with the 8 legged variety - too much squishing when they get into places where they're not invited. I'm not purposely horrible to them, but they should make more effort to buy their own slippers instead of trying to wear mine ;)

[traq]

Hello Friends,

I am newbie in this forum, please support me.

Welcome to DynamicDrive.

[djr33]

Snow. Cold. Is anyone else "enjoying" (as I am) this terrible arctic storm across the northern US?
Here in Illinois I guess the worst is over because it's now finally 10 whole degrees, rather than, y'know, -10. But now attempting to get back to normal means waiting for the snow to be removed from the roads-- I just went out (after just staying inside for the last few days) to the grocery store and the normal 5 minute drive took me about 20-30 minutes navigating the (surprisingly busy) traffic, then getting stuck in the driveway of my apartment complex. And many people are stuck traveling anywhere, with plains, trains and buses all shut down. Crazy...

Oh well.... at least the internet is still going. Hope none of you coders lost power :)

[Nile]

Snow. Cold. Is anyone else "enjoying" (as I am) this terrible arctic storm across the northern US?
Yes, -45F wind chill is exactly what I look forward to on Mondays. But in all seriousness, we had 2 inclement weather days. Unfortunately those days extended our winter break. To be honest I'd rather have a break in the middle of school than an extension on an already-long break. But I'll take it, still. :D

[djr33]

I think I might like fewer breaks and longer weekends...

[Nile]

I think I might like fewer breaks and longer weekends...

Interesting. I've thought about this before. The fact is that humans are naturally happier when doing work, but want to do nothing (or so I've been told that's a fact but can't remember where I heard it and don't have a source to site). Anyways, I'm not sure that everybody agrees with this, but I do under most circumstances. During long winter and summer breaks, it's easy to fall into an "end of day"-depression. I find that taking breaks throughout the year instead of a few long ones is better for mental health (at least for myself). I've also seen a similar trend with other students around me (even though it's probably something they wouldn't admit to).

[djr33]

Exactly what you said. And while I can't cite any sources on that, I'm positive it's true. Happiness is by definition contrastive. That's why money can't buy happiness. It quite literally can, but only for a short time. Then it's boring.

[Nile]

Exactly what you said. And while I can't cite any sources on that, I'm positive it's true. Happiness is by definition contrastive. That's why money can't buy happiness. It quite literally can, but only for a short time. Then it's boring.

When you said you prefer fewer breaks, that means you'd rather have longer breaks then, no?

[djr33]

Bad phrasing-- fewer long breaks. I meant shorter breaks, I guess. I'll blame the cold for my typos.


Err... no, I said it right. But it was confusing. I meant fewer breaks, which are long. More long weekends. I don't consider weekends to be breaks. But whatever, it didn't make sense :confused:

[PorthosMaximus]

Not entirely certain if this is the right place, but seeing as it's labeled "the social thread", I figured it was as good a place as any to say hi to everyone, this is my first post on the forums. Happy to be here!

[djr33]

Welcome to the forums!


(And, sure, this thread is fine. It's intentionally off topic, just as long as it's not spam.)

[keyboard]

Welcome PorthosMaximus!

[djr33]

This is the best 404 page I've ever seen:
http://folk.uio.no/larsbun/

[Beverleyh]

Genius!

[jscheuer1]

In addition to that, no page was found, when it was found, that this page was not under construction.

[Beverleyh]

Lol :D

[laiokon]

Hi all. I'm just beginning and I'm going to quickly catch up. Forgive me if I say at the beginning of something stupid. Thanks for such a source of knowledge.

[james438]

Welcome to the forum laiokon, most everyone here is pretty understanding as we've all been an absolute beginner at some point. We're all still learning new coding tricks all the time :) For myself I am still learning coding tricks, but at a slower pace than previously as other things in life have been taking up more of my time. Most recently I have progressed from Windows XP to Windows 7 after long deliberation and discussion here on the forums and among people I know face to face and I am observing the differences between the two operating systems. I just installed Windows 7 yesterday :p

[JoePoe]

Hey, my name is Joe. I don't know is this thread to say hello? I didn't found "Hello Thread" so i decided to write here. Please don't warn me if i did wrong.
Anyway, my name is Joe.
I am from Bolton and my hobby is SEO, i also work in SEO so I connected job with interestings. I am 24 years old and I am married with my beautiful Laura. I hope my time here will be pleasant.

[keyboard]

This is a great place to say hello and get to know the other forum'ers.
Welcome to the forums Joe :)

[djr33]

Hi Joe and welcome!

[iil888]

Hi,

My name is Juan an I just wanted to say Hello to the community. I am 48, and I develop WP blogs and do SEO to earn my living.

Thanks.

[keyboard]

Welcome Juan!

[raj5151]

Hi all, Today I joined here. I hope I will learn something from here

[AndrewGi]

Hello everyone! I guess this is the perfect place to say 'Hi' :)

[keyboard]

Welcome to both of you :)

[isthisreality]

Hi everyone, I just joined dynamic drive forums. I want to say hello to everyone and I hope to learn something from here! cheers.

[simonbirch1973]

Hi Guys, Just joined. Here to brush up and learn more coding skills.

Cheers

Simon

[james438]

welcome to the forums isthisreality and simonbirch1973 :) I hope you enjoy your stay and find a lot of helpful information.

[jscheuer1]

Aw, I wanted the 400th response in this thread! (kidding)

[Indilla]

Hello everyone!

[Sisi]

Great avatar!

[Izzyi]

It's good to set up a goal each day.

[bulalea]

Hello, hello

[jscheuer1]

"Tao Te Ching - Lao Tzu - chapter 14

Look, it cannot be seen - it is beyond form.
Listen, it cannot be heard - it is beyond sound.
Grasp, it cannot be held - it is intangible.
These three are indefinable;
Therefore they are joined in one.

From above it is not bright;
From below it is not dark:
An unbroken thread beyond description.
It returns to nothingness.
The form of the formless,
The image of the imageless,
It is called indefinable and beyond imagination.

Stand before it and there is no beginning.
Follow it and there is no end.
Stay with the ancient Tao,
Move with the present.

Knowing the ancient beginning is the essence of Tao."

And, as far as I can tell, also the essence of the YouTube iframe javascript api. :D

[molendijk]

There's no beginning
Nor is there end
And there's no silence
Nor is there sound
No form nor chaos
No future nor past
When I'm not born yet
Or when I'm dead

[ketty]

Hello! I'm Ana from Spain. I'm new here.

[jscheuer1]

Hello, can anyone tell me the reason I can't specify an avatar in my profile? Thanks.

Too new, maybe later.

[ajfmrf]

Welcome to the Forum bewerbung.

This is a great place to learn at,give and get help too

[jscheuer1]

Does Windows 10 make me look fat?

[molendijk]

Does Windows 10 make me look fat?
Since you asked for it: yes.

5926

[jscheuer1]

Uhg! Glad I haven't updated!!

[mlegg]

Have you really not updated yet? I really like it.

[jscheuer1]

I reserved an update early on, as soon as they were announced, it hasn't become available yet for my particular configuration. I'm beginning to have my doubts that it will.

[MattHillburn]

Just introducing myself to the group. Here to learn - probably won't contribute much of anything for awhile. I manufacture and sell storm shelters (http://www.tornadoshelter.com) for a living, but am learning to program in my downtime!

- Matt Hillburn

[james438]

Welcome to the forums Matt! There are a lot of great threads here. Even if you don't have anything to contribute just yet, if you are following a thread you find interesting, feel free to ask about something you don't understand.

[keyboard]

Welcome to the community Matt!

[Ben Jenkins]

Any other web designers from the St. Louis area in this forum? I'm a St. Louis Landscaper (http://www.landscapedesignstlouis.com) by day and a coder by night!

[meomeoconmeo]

Hi every one. I'm Anna Corigant. Now i am 23 years old and recently I started my own little business. I want to learn more and how to make money in this big beautiful world. Thank you

[DesNat]

Hey guys! I'm new to this forum and it's nice to virtually meet you all.

[Kuznec]

Hello everybody. I'm glad to be on this forum and I wish everyone good.

[bestellen]

I hope you enjoy your stay and find a lot of helpful information.

[HotAsIce]

hey yall! im a new coder.

[Rotoer]

Wait for keyboard, as a very new FF user, he'll most likely defend Firefox rather vehemently :P

[bestellen]

I do that sort of thing all the time!

[FlatAssembler]

Hey, guys!
I've tried to make a website in raw HTML, but I am not a professional web-designer. You can see it here:
http://flatassembler.000webhostapp.com/
Do you have some ideas on how to improve it that are easy to program?

[mlegg]

fix your code errors https://validator.w3.org/nu/?doc=http%3A%2F%2Fflatassembler.000webhostapp.com%2F

[FlatAssembler]

I don't think THOSE errors are the reason why Opera and Internet Explorer appear to ignore half of the CSS, neither that they are the reason why the JavaScript generated SVGs look whitish in pretty much all browsers except Safari. Do you have some tool for finding CSS errors?

[FlatAssembler]

Never mind, the folks on the xkcd forum helped me find those errors.

[james438]

Things have been a bit quieter recently, but the moderators are active and you will most likely get an answer soon.

[Met]

Hello! I'm a beginner and I do not know which of the famous browsers can be the best.

[james438]

Welcome to the forums Met :).

[keyboard]

Hey guys! I'm new to this forum and it's really nice to meet you all :D

Welcome! :)

[beautifuljosephine]

Hi! I am also new. About me: I am 39. I am the mother of 2 children. But I am very interested in coding. My goal: To create a website from scratch.

[keyboard]

Personally I've never used XCode so I can't comment on that, but it depends what you want to do.
If you want to make apps for iOS then use XCode for sure.

Otherwise, Java is a widely used language that can do a lot of things.

[GabiJohnson]

Well, congratulations to all of them, especially keyboard, who I didn't think would ever get mod another thing that's interesting, the highest post count on a non-mod is now about 10,000

[MayaWilson]

I found the picture his avatar was from the other day, it's a picture of all the browsers as kids, and chrome and Firefox fighting away, while ie is eating glue

[james438]

Here is a somewhat old link, so the illustrations may be a bit dated, but still amusing. 20 Amazing War Of Web Browsers Artwork Pictures (https://www.hdpixels.net/2012/05/20-amazing-war-of-web-browsers-artwork.html)

[JoshFerguson]

Goal achieved: have a higher post per day than three of the mods
New goal: get more posts than one of the mods

[james438]

Not a bad goal, but just be sure that you are posting something useful and not posting for the sake of posting.

To help with your goal, there are two active mods and one admin.

[coothead]

...there are two active mods and one admin.

...and coothead. :D

[james438]

well, can't disagree with that ;)

[coothead]

Hi there James,



I've been a daily visitor to numerous coding forums for over fifteen years.

Sadly now, I can count their number on the fingers of one hand.





coothead

[james438]

I am happy that we are still one of those forums :)

With everything going on, be sure to stay healthy!

[Christ88]

what's the mean of the DD social thread?

[keyboard]

Hi Christ88, it's just a social thread that we have had for as long as I can remember for people to chat

[Christ88]

Hi Christ88, it's just a social thread that we have had for as long as I can remember for people to chat

That's great work.

[JungleBoy666]

Hey everyone, how you doin'? Am I the only one who hates Windows updates?

[Christ88]

Hey everyone, how you doin'? Am I the only one who hates Windows updates?

I also hate windows updates.

[james438]

That's a big reason why I enjoy Windows 7 :)

[DonCallis]

Yeah, Windows 7 is still great!

[milesstone]

Hello everyone I am newbie here and I am glad to meet you all.